“You and your cohort trashed a book I’d spent a long time and lot of work on. It’s like me walking up and telling you your kid is ugly and smells bad.”
Sunday, June 1, 2008Posted in: e-book authors posting under the influence, e-pubbed authors behaving like fucktards?, Epublishers
Says, Adra Steia disgruntled author, in response to a negative review from Holly at Book Binge.
Who is Adra Steia, I hear you ask.. well to be honest, I have no clue. But apparently she’s a best-selling e-book author. Erm, so she says at least.
Anyway, here’s the story: Holly from Book Binge apparently read Ms Steia’s book, and didn’t like it, in fact she went on to include said book in her Worst Read in 2007 post.
Adra apparently wasn’t impressed and allegedly started commenting anonymously, a la sock puppet.
Anyway, Holly then put this post up, basically outing her. Adra Steia responded, and responded, and responded, and responded…
Below are some wonderful examples of why authors should know when to step away from the keyboard.
Adra Steia writes:
People, I don’t care. I haven’t since, what, September? I DID google my name for further reviews, found this, and found it insanely hilarious. (The book you reviewed has received nothing but recommended reads and other great reviews– that says much more than the ‘review’ you all did of it!).
I’m laughing at you all. Not crying about a bad review. LAUGHING. Big difference.
I’m laughing even more now….
Yeah, she really sounds like she doesn’t care, doesn’t she?
This next bit made me smile:
Oh, one more thing before I once again forget you all exist…thanks for all the sales! Every time you mention my book, my slaes jump way up!
So apparently, Adra Steia’s sales are jumping every time her book is mentioned at Book Binge. You’d think she’d be more grateful wouldn’t you?
Some more examples of how not to respond to a negative review:
Seriously. I didn’t post that original comment. As I said, I looked at that post and LAUGHED. It’s funny. You hated the book, but it made an impact on you, such a huge impact that it made not one, not two, but THREE Worst Read lists!
Here, Steia continues to dig herself a deeper hole:
I don’t care what you people have to say about me. You just made yourself look immature and childish in front of the whole world. THAT’S what I’m laughing about. You don’t come off as snarky or witty or amusing. Except, of course, to your friends. To anyone else…you just look pathetic. How long has it been since you got out of high school? Most people put the love for drama behind them.
I did react strongly to that review–for a day or two. You and your cohort trashed a book I’d spent a long time and lot of work on. It’s like me walking up and telling you your kid is ugly and smells bad. Just like you’d be highly pissed at me, you have to understand that that’s how I felt for a little while.
Wow…
I wonder if she’ll ever see the irony in this statement:
Most people put the love for drama behind them.
Especially when she commented eight times on Holly’s post.
Ya know what, though? I got over it. I moved on. I wrote more books. All of which get great reviews and have great SALES. You don’t matter. Your review didn’t matter in the long run. It hurt, I put a bandaid on it, and MOVED ON.
Your ‘letter’, though, is just a huge testament to the kind of person and reviewer you really are. And it’s on my blog now. Let’s see how much more immature and vindictive and childish you can be…
Absolutely amazing.
This next bit had me laughing my tits off:
I can take a bad review. It’s a challenge for the overcome when I write my NEXT book. I’m not so emotionally attached to my books that the world ends when one gets a bad review.
She’s doing real well at handling a negative review isn’t she? She’s definitely giving a stellar performance.
You unfairly attacked me–someone who has not even VISITED this blog in months. Someone stood up for me, and you are so consumed with…sheesh, I don’t even know…yourself, I guess, that you assume it was someone who couldn’t care less about you or your blog. When you attack me PERSONALLY, yeah I’m going to respond. I want people to see how you ‘wonderful’ people REALLY are. My blog gets hundreds of visitors a day, many of which buy at least one of my books.
And to the person who said I should be thanking them…read my earlier comments. I did thank them, thank you! I’ve already sold quite a few numbers of the book in question, as well as several other copies of my horror novels. I’m the one making the money off this, and once again, I thank you.
Keep up the diatribe, please… it’s doing wonders for my sales.
Once again, the mention of the jump in sales of her book. Do we think she’s telling porkies or what?
This whole thing is retarded and childish. I’m a writer. I’ve had six books accepted and published. I’ve proven to the world that I am a capable author. My books are bestsellers, and I sell out at book signings. Your review didn’t just destroy my world and turn me into a sniveling little weakling and leave me cowering in a corner.
You can post nasty things about me left and right, and trash me and my books and still…it’s not going to matter. You’re weak. You couldn’t resist the urge to just ignore the comment–or bring yourself to check the IP address against the ones in the posts that I willingly, happily signed my name too. Ya know why? ‘Cuz you know you’d look like an idiot for going off on someone who had NOTHING to do with this.
Bear in mind guys, that she’s talking about The Book Binge Girls. I mean come on, The Book Binge Girls? On what planet are they considered mean girls?
This is just an attempt to make yourself look more superior, more intelligent, and more snarky. Guess what? YOU are the weak link here. It’s all pack mentality. Most people have no clue who I am, and you’re just sending more and more people to my blog and my website.
If she is getting more hits to her blog, surely she should be grateful? As AztecLady already noted, first she says she’s a huge best-seller, then she admits to nobody knowing who she is. Which statement is nearer to the truth do we think? I’ll give y’all one guess.
I DID show my friends and cronies the link. One of which is an author you all despise as well. I probably directed about 20 people here– hits for you blogs, ladies, you should be happy. We all had a big laugh.
Thats how me and my friends roll—and lots of other authors. We celebrate our victories and our less-than-victories. It was a public post, was it not? I had ever right to pass it around to my friends. In no way does that warrant an all out attack from you. I never posted a word about it anywhere, my blog or otherwise. Only my direct circle of friend (those 20 or so people) knew about it.
I wonder if she has a publicist?
I’m still getting over the fact that she used the ‘That’s how me and my friends roll’ line. This is a best-selling author don’tcha know.
She then goes on to admit that perhaps her book wasn’t the best thing evah:
My book isn’t the best thing since sliced bread. Shoot, I admit that. I’m not so conceited that I can’t see the flaws. Beyond saying the book is different than one you’d most likely read, I didn’t say anything above and beyond about it.
The problem with your reviews were the utter-closed-mindedness of them. But, that’s your opinion. It’s your blog, you write what you want to about the books that are submitted. I run a book review website. I know that and understand it. BUt when an author complains to me that either I or one of my reviewers missed something, if it’s a justifiable complaint, we look into it.
That one book in particular was the one and only romance I’ve ever written and will ever write. I write horror. I’ve never even tried writing another romance, because, well, I don’t like romance. I don’t care that you didn’t like my book. Plenty of other people do.
Yep, that’s definitely the sound of yet another author shooting herself in her own foot. Ya gotta love ’em right?
What a fucktard.
Casee
June 2
10:12 pm
This comment still drives me crazy. How is a review close-minded when you’ve read the e n t i r e book and are reviewing it just like you’ve reviewed every other book you’ve read?
Emma Petersen
June 3
1:11 am
Le sigh.
Forgive me in advance if I sound half coherent, lack of sleep and my ex’s crazy mother (Lord forgive me) will do that.
Okay. I have met a lot of authors. Some of them have been really good friends and some have been merely acquaintances. Out of these friends and acquaintances I’ve encountered more than one that had to be on constant guard to protect their private identities, because
a. they were victims of violent crimes, domestic or otherwise
b. they signed discretionary clauses with employers
c. they were clergy/wives of clergy.
I honestly don’t know if this is the case with Adra, but who wants to take the chance that it is? Whether she acted inappropriately or does not know how to conceal her personal information who wants to take the chance that posting her personal information can cause her or her family harm.
We all make mistakes. Lord knows I’ve made more than my share. But should making a mistake automatically mean our lives should be negatively impacted by it permanently?
No, I’m not going to suggest we all hold hands and sing kumbaya. And I’ve already stepped off my soapbox, I was getting dizzy up there anyway.
Ann Somerville
June 3
1:35 am
Shiloh, last response on this, then I’m not going to comment on this issue again. There is no parallel with the DM situation. DM was given private information, obtained privately, from someone who had no business sharing it. She then used the possession of this information to threaten Reba into silence. You cannot fling that woman’s name into this without an inference being drawn that you consider there to be similarities with what I did here. You say you were drawing a parallel – same thing. There are no similarities with the DM case, unless you count the fact that Adra is similarly obsessed with reviews and similarly unhinged in her reactions.
I stated that Adra is committing a fraud against Amazon customers. To prove and describe that fraud, her ‘real’ name/alternate identity had to be mentioned because she *uses* her real name to commit that fraud. Amazon even declare it to be her ‘real name’ (although it may not be). As you are aware, you have to explicitly give Amazon permission to label your review name that way, so Adra has done so. For some reason, you consider WHOIS information as somehow how special and sacrosanct. It’s not. If Karen wants to edit out the line I added about that, I’m happy that she does so – but that information is readily available. Moreover, it won’t remove Adra’s ‘real’ (allegedly) name from Amazon.
The difference between Reba’s situation and Adra’s is this – Reba was an entirely innocent customer being stalked by a crazed author, who did not publicly draw attention to her real identity. Adra is a crazed author trying to manipulate customers into her buying her book under false pretences, and very explicitly using another identity – which she explicitly links on her website – to do so. Now, unless you demand Karen takes down the links to her website, there is no way you can prevent people seeing that information.
What you seem to be saying is that if an author commits this kind of deception using what is assumed to be her legal name (again, we have no proof of that since she uses at least three different identities in her online life), then she can’t be outed as doing so, purely to protect her entirely hypothetical children and family. Do you not have any concern about the customers again being cheated by the manipulation of reviews?
Since the lady herself shoves the information right in a site visitor’s face, I’d like to know why you think this was some great investigative feat. I wasn’t, moreover, going ‘ooh, look, her real name is X’ just for the hell of it, or to threaten and intimidate her. I had a purpose – to expose shenanigans – as I’ve described above. It’s by no means the first time Karen’s blog has given out such information for the same reason – witness the discussions about shady publishers and so in the recent past (yet I can’t recall a single instance where you popped up to decry those revelations.) When someone practices to deceive, then they open themselves up to uncomfortable questions and exposure.
People have been looking up my WHOIS information in the last few days (I suspect possibily as a result of my comments on the previous post about ferfelabat et al) – that shows up in my referrer stats. It’s a risk you run in owning a domain. There are various ways to protect yourself. You can, as many people do despite the illegality, use fake names for contact info/registration. You can also use a company name. You can use a proxy registrar, or you can use an information-obscuring service as I do. But WHOIS information is pretty much the first thing a lot of people – especially web savvy people – do, when they are interested in a website. You may be unaware of that, but I can’t be held accountable for your ignorance in that matter.
AztecLady
June 3
2:05 am
What bothers me, Ann, is that there was no need to put the information here. Simply saying, “she’s reviewing her own books on amazon” would have allowed anyone so inclined to check.
Yes, Ms Steia (irresponsibly, in my opinion) put that information out there for anyone with the time, inclination, and savvy to obtain.
No, it’s not your duty–nor mine for that matter–to protect Ms Steia’s family. But neither it is necessary to expose them–whomever they may be–to further risks by compounding Ms Steia’s irresponsible behaviour.
At least that’s my take.
Shiloh Walker
June 3
2:26 am
Ann, flat-out, I’ll be honest-I have no idea what you said in your post beyond my name-I didn’t bother to read it. There’s no point-I can consider your viewpoint until the cows come home. However, you rarely show anybody else that consideration, unless their view point aligns with yours or is similar to your own. Because of that, no open discussion can happen. So reading your comments? Pointless.
Regardless of what you say, how easy some info is to find… there is no reason, no justification for putting it out there.
None. And that’s pretty much all I have to say to you about this.
Shiloh Walker
June 3
2:28 am
Casee, people love to argue that any time they are misunderstood, it is because of closemindedness.
But their idea of being closed-mind is generally anything that doesn’t agree with THEIR opinion.
It’s an annoying attitude, but one that’s a fact of life. Wasting any time focusing on it just isn’t worth it, IMO.
Robin
June 3
2:31 am
I also don’t see the parallel to the DAM situation and think that was an unfair comparison.
In general I am torn about these information issues. OTOH, I think there’s a sort of “gentleman’s agreement” that most of us adhere to, an acknowledgment that a certain amount of privacy should be allowed us, even if it’s not legally required. So in that sense I am more often than not willing to let that stand for someone else, especially if they seem to desire it, and even if I don’t think they are being completely forthright in a given situation.
OTOH, if you spend more than ten seconds on Adra Steia’s myspace page, she does put a whole lot of information right there in your face. And then there’s the Amazon thing. She doesn’t exactly appear to be trying to keep her identities separate. It reminds me a bit of the author who got pissed that she was “outed” when her book was released with a pseudonym on the cover and her real name on the book’s copyright page. Hello . . .
So how much searching is too much? I think that’s a judgment call, and I certainly don’t think this situation is anywhere near what DAM did to Reba Belle. Maybe this discussion is similar to the paparazzi/celebrity debate.
Jen
June 3
2:34 am
Ann Somerville should have a look at Mrs. Giggles’s recent post about “the glee showed by authors on the plight of their fellow authors who were targeted by bloggers.” Adra Steia behaved like a fucktard no doubt, but the response by some on this thread has seemed, in the opinion of this lurker, disproportionate.
Shiloh Walker
June 3
2:59 am
Robin, I’m not comparing Ann to DAM. I’m not sure there is any comparison to DAM.
However… I do see a parallel… plain and simply, one person had private info about Reba. I’m suspecting it was an author who’d sent her a book, not a private investigator as claimed. What I think happened is that this author had personal info and she shared it with DAM.
DAM then took it upon herself to share it with all asunder.
Ann was able to get Steia’s info-by public means, yes. But she accessed it, and then posted it.
I don’t believe Ann took the time to think about whether she should share it.
Just as whoever gave DAM the info on Reba didn’t take the time to think about whether that info should be shared.
It’s my opinion only, people are welcome to disagree, but no explanation can justify the need to share personal info.
Now I’m curious.
As to how much searching is too much… I just can’t see any reason to justify a need to search out any info on this.
Anon
June 3
3:02 am
Well, after having done some general asking around, it seems Ms. Somerville is regarded as a universal fucktard in her own right, someone (here’s the irony) accused of manipulating reviews herself.
And no, I have no pony in this race. I just find it interesting that those who are usually so quick to berate others often have skeletons of their own.
I agree with Jen, and Mrs. G’s recent comment also came to my mind. Perhaps it’s a case of “phew, thank god it wasn’t me.”
Ann Somerville
June 3
3:13 am
Shiloh, don’t talk about me if you aren’t going to talk to me. And don’t make *any* assumptions about what I did or did not do before I made that post.
As for your opinion of me, well, rest assured I give it all the weight it deserves.
Anon, I’d rather be disliked, despised and maligned than a lying coward like you. I’m aware there is no shortage of people to trash talk me, just as the great and admired Shiloh Walker has seen fit to. If you hang around with bottom feeders, as you appear to, of course you’ll suck up shit.
AztecLady
June 3
3:20 am
Oh for crying out loud, Ann!
Ann Somerville
June 3
3:28 am
Azteclady, you have me at a disadvantage. I would very much like to ask you what the problem is, in private, to keep this off this post, but you don’t have any contact information. Please feel free to email me – contact link on my site.
Shiloh Walker
June 3
3:37 am
I’m getting ready to do something I hate… and that’s make an apology-and sad sigh, it’s because of Robin’s level-headedness. I’ve been thinking about her comment since she posted, and even after my reply, I kept thinking about it.
I *do* see a parallel between the info that was given to DAM and the info that was posted about Steia. Two people had info, but DAM isn’t the one I was referring to. I failed to make that clear, and I apologize.
I very much believe that a fellow author had info about Reba and shared it.
Just as Ann was able to access certain info, and share it.
But I don’t believe anything Ann has said or done compares to what DAM did. As I mentioned a few posts ago, I don’t think anybody will quite live up to that.
However, I did make an unfair comment . For that, I’ll apologize. It’s not something I like doing, and it’s not something I do unless I really feel I need to, but in this case, I think it’s necessary.
Ann, whether you read this or not, I do apologize for the comparison comment regarding you and DM. It was unfair and I wasn’t clear enough on why I saw a parallel. I would probably be ticked off if somebody compared me to her as well.
This doesn’t mean I think I was wrong about my comments regarding whether or not personal info should be shared. I do not and cannot see a need for it. But I didn’t need to bring DM into it.
Robin
June 3
3:42 am
I tried to post this already, but it disappeared, so I removed the link to RT I had included and am trying again.
But isn’t that sort of the nature of the debate, Shiloh? What constitutes personal and private information? I mean, how many times has Karen been dinged here for posting what others consider to be “personal” or “private” information? What about all the comments STILL being articulated on the RT messageboard about how what the SBs and DA did with the Cassie Edwards situation was a violation of Edwards’s privacy? WAS what Ann posted personal and private? What about what the Smoking Gun posts when it provides court documents or contracts?
As for the difference here between a parallel and a comparison — IMO it’s semantic. I read your comments as making a comparison.[ETA: I just saw your apology to Ann, Shiloh, so this part of my comment is outdated].
Anon
June 3
3:43 am
Ann, you just enjoy the drama, don’t you? Anyone and anything you can attack, you do. I’ve seen you drag more than one person into your commentary now in an attempt to make them look bad.
The more shit you throw on the pile, the more you’re going to get on yourself.
Shiloh Walker
June 3
3:51 am
Well, that’s a good question. I think anything that can be used to ‘locate’ a person should be considered personal and private.
I personally don’t think a person’s behavior, no matter how foolish it is, warrants sharing their info with anybody and everybody.
Now if the behavior is bordering on dangerous, I do think people need to know whatever is necessary to protect themselves. Incidents of stalking definitely border and downright smash the border of dangerous. But I can say that when somebody posted personal info of DM over at DA, I didn’t see the need for it.
A person acts like an ass and people want to drag their tail thru the mud, that I got no problem with.
But deciding that you’ve got a right to share info that can too easily be abused, and sharing it with anybody and everybody, never knowing who is reading that info, and knowing just how long (practically forever) that info is available on the web… well, I’ve already made my point clear. I don’t see any reason for it.
Tuscan Capo
June 3
4:03 am
You know, hearing the big ugly beastly “F” moniker can be humorous when Karen does it, but I don’t know, seeing it tossed around a blog thread like a wadded gum wrapper? It just kind of loses its special meaning and takes on a cheap glint like those kiddie rings you get out of a vending machine. Maybe its one moniker best reserved for people who are most deserving, like Idi Amin or Hitler.
Oh, and good evening Karen. Thanks for yesterday 🙂
Shiloh Walker
June 3
4:06 am
CAPO! Where in the world did you go?
Shiloh Walker
June 3
4:07 am
Oh… happy sigh… Capo has a new blog.
Robin
June 3
4:15 am
The main point I’m trying to make is that the line that is so very bright and shiny for you isn’t in the same place for everyone. I struggle all the time with the “private and personal” line, and while some cases are clear to me (e.g. what DAM did was on the wrong side), other (more) situations fall into the gray (e.g. the Gail Northman letter made public by the SBs). Essentially I think it’s possible — and even good — for reasonable people to disagree on this, because IMO it *is* an ongoing discussion, and I personally like the possibility of having it be relatively open so that I can continue to refine my own thinking about where my own lines should be and are drawn.
Ann Somerville
June 3
4:18 am
Shiloh, thank you for your apology.
I did actually say openly over on that DM thread that I believed it was wrong to post DM’s real name – because it wasn’t readily available and she had gone to quite extreme lengths to conceal it, as is her right. People like Reba are entitled to find that information out, but they can do that in private. I don’t and didn’t see Adra as being in the same situation, but I respect your sensitivity on this issue.
We will have to agree to disagree about the rest of it. I see your point, but I don’t accept it. I’m sorry if you think that’s pigheaded, but it’s the way it is. I have quite strong issues about my privacy as well, but for reasons I already stated at overlong length, I don’t believe I did anything wrong here.
I would be happy if Karen were to make all necessary edits to fit in with your requirements. You will have to understand in the end, that’s her judgment call.
Anon, do run away.
Shiloh Walker
June 3
4:25 am
The ego-centric in me wants to know…why not? 😉
But the reasonable person in me understands that.
I think the best way for people to handle it is to think how it would be if the situation was flipped.
All the personal deets that are shared in various places… whoever did the sharing, would they be so open about sharing if they received the same treatment in kind? One thing that helps me define my own lines is thinking how I’d feel if whatever situation was reversed. If I think I’d take issue, then I consider that first and foremost.
I suspect it will be an on-going debate, and one that won’t have a resolution, probably. But reasonable debate is always good.
Well, unless it’s really late and I’m really tired…then my brain doesn’t process logic well.
With that in mind, Robin, I’ve decided you’re too logical for my brain cells considering how little sleep I’ve gotten, so I’m going to bed.
Y’all have a good night.
Tuscan Capo
June 3
4:28 am
Hey Shiloh. Its a complicated story, but the short and sweet, due to some criminal activity by individuals we’d rather not mention we felt it necessary to destroy all our old personal files, including those maintained for the previous blog. It sucks, but life goes on. And Bailey and I are now married and visiting my family. And honestly, I’ve never been happier. Thanks for asking sweetheart and have a great night!
Ann Somerville
June 3
4:37 am
Robin, except in cases of criminality and so on, I would say that my personal line on this (for living people) is where
(a) the personal information is readily and publicly available. So, for instance, when an actor uses a stage name, an author uses another pen name, or when they make no effort to obscure public records – like WHOIS
AND
(b) there is actually a reason to reveal the information – i.e., it’s pertinent.
AND
(c) the information revealed is limited to what is pertinent. So, in this case, the alternate name Steia used to review herself, but not her address, phone number, email address, children’s names etc.
All those criteria must be satisfied for *my* comfort level.
Several people have said, ‘oh why didn’t you just say she reviewed herself and let them do the investigating?’ What I would like to ask them is – what is the fundamental difference between posting the information direct and that? And where is the line for *that*? Is it okay for me to say ‘you can look up her WHOIS info’ but not tell them how to? Can I connect the dots you’ll find if you do the same breadcrumb trail as I did, or do I have to let you work it out for yourself?
Jane over at DA not only (rightly) deleted DM’s real name but also the description of the method used and the links – again, rightly IMO, because that was a really obscure bit of searching that only people local to the area would be aware of. But WHOIS is international, and so are Amazon and so are websites. Does drawing a map of how it’s done, while forbearing from naming names, violate the ‘no personal info’ line?
I really do want to know this. I was shocked by the reaction I got here, and as Robin said, there is a considerable grey area. What are the lines people use?
Shiloh – “would they be so open about sharing if they received the same treatment in kind”. In my case, I’ve had *worse* done to me out of sheer malice. So the answer is yes – but only for the right reasons.
Karen Scott
June 3
8:21 am
I’m gone for a day, and all hell breaks loose.
I’ve spammed Ann’s comment because apparently hotel wireless connections are crap, and wont show me the edit function on here. Anyway, will de-spam, and edit out the info when I get home sometime tonight.
I think the DAM comparison was a tad unfair. No she probably shouldn’t have posted the info, but I’d say she’s suitably sorry now, even though she might not admit it. We all make mistakes, and as abrasive as Ann can be, I find it hard to believe she was being malicious when she posted that info. A bad judgement call I think.
Let’s move on.
Shiloh Walker
June 3
12:51 pm
I’ve always been good at trouble-making.
I’ll apologize again for the comment and my lack of clarity on why I said it. It will be a long time coming (I hope) before anybody lives up to DAM.
I’ve pretty said all I need to say about this one, so I’m definitely moving on.
Edited.